Update CoreUtils

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Update CoreUtils

Steven Penny
current Cygwin version is 8.15
http://cygwin.com/packages/x86_64/coreutils

8.16 was released over 2 years ago
http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/coreutils

MSYS2 is already using 8.22
http://github.com/Alexpux/MSYS2-packages/blob/master/coreutils/PKGBUILD

Can we get an update? I can create a build if needed.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Thomas Wolff

Am 11.05.2014 18:42, schrieb Steven Penny:

> current Cygwin version is 8.15
> http://cygwin.com/packages/x86_64/coreutils
>
> 8.16 was released over 2 years ago
> http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/coreutils
>
> MSYS2 is already using 8.22
> http://github.com/Alexpux/MSYS2-packages/blob/master/coreutils/PKGBUILD
>
> Can we get an update? I can create a build if needed.
The current version of `expand` is not UTF-8 aware (and thus garbles
output).
If that's fixed upstream (which I don't know), I would strongly
appreciate an update, too.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Eric Blake (cygwin)-2
In reply to this post by Steven Penny
On 05/11/2014 10:42 AM, Steven Penny wrote:

> current Cygwin version is 8.15
> http://cygwin.com/packages/x86_64/coreutils
>
> 8.16 was released over 2 years ago
> http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/coreutils
>
> MSYS2 is already using 8.22
> http://github.com/Alexpux/MSYS2-packages/blob/master/coreutils/PKGBUILD
>
> Can we get an update? I can create a build if needed.
I haven't relinquished maintainership of this package yet.  It's still
on my list of things to build, when I get a moment (although free time
has been a bit sparse as of late with the birth of my daughter last month).

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Eric Blake (cygwin)-2
In reply to this post by Thomas Wolff
On 05/11/2014 01:10 PM, Thomas Wolff wrote:

>
> Am 11.05.2014 18:42, schrieb Steven Penny:
>> current Cygwin version is 8.15
>> http://cygwin.com/packages/x86_64/coreutils
>>
>> 8.16 was released over 2 years ago
>> http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/coreutils
>>
>> MSYS2 is already using 8.22
>> http://github.com/Alexpux/MSYS2-packages/blob/master/coreutils/PKGBUILD
>>
>> Can we get an update? I can create a build if needed.
> The current version of `expand` is not UTF-8 aware (and thus garbles
> output).
> If that's fixed upstream (which I don't know), I would strongly
> appreciate an update, too.
Upstream does not handle multibyte locales very well.  It is a much
bigger problem than just expand, and while some distros like Fedora have
provided downstream hacks that attempt to provide UTF-8, I am not very
willing to port them to cygwin if they aren't in a shape to push
upstream first (particularly since cygwin's wchar_t is a different width
than glibc, and therefore the downstream patches for Linux may fail to
work on cygwin without a lot of tweaking).

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Steven Penny
In reply to this post by Eric Blake (cygwin)-2
On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 9:52 AM, Eric Blake wrote:
> I haven't relinquished maintainership of this package yet.  It's still
> on my list of things to build, when I get a moment (although free time
> has been a bit sparse as of late with the birth of my daughter last month).

Frankly I dont see how you can hold maintainer and not even update once a year.
Between

- coreutils
- bash
- git
- lack of a real package manager

all being way out of date I have already switched to MSYS2 once. The only reason
I came back is they still havent fixed the jacked mount points

    C:/msys64 on /usr
    C:/msys64 on /

while Cygwin correctly does

    C:/cygwin64/bin on /usr/bin
    C:/cygwin64/lib on /usr/lib
    C:/cygwin64 on /

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Christopher Faylor-8
On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 04:33:06PM -0500, Steven Penny wrote:

>On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 9:52 AM, Eric Blake wrote:
>> I haven't relinquished maintainership of this package yet.  It's still
>> on my list of things to build, when I get a moment (although free time
>> has been a bit sparse as of late with the birth of my daughter last month).
>
>Frankly I dont see how you can hold maintainer and not even update once a year.
>Between
>
>- coreutils
>- bash
>- git
>- lack of a real package manager
>
>all being way out of date I have already switched to MSYS2 once. The only reason
>I came back is they still havent fixed the jacked mount points
>
>    C:/msys64 on /usr
>    C:/msys64 on /
>
>while Cygwin correctly does
>
>    C:/cygwin64/bin on /usr/bin
>    C:/cygwin64/lib on /usr/lib
>    C:/cygwin64 on /

Frankly, please give MSYS2 another try.  We'd all appreciate it.

cgf

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Steven Penny
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 12:56 AM, Christopher Faylor wrote:
> Frankly, please give MSYS2 another try.  We'd all appreciate it.

Look at the facts:

coreutils
newer version released 2 years ago

bash
newer version released 3 years ago

git
newer version released 2 years ago

These are major packages, not just "user X favorite package". Several people
including myself have offered to update them, only to be met with "Sorry, I am
maintainer not you. I will do it when I get time". It gets old after a while.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Peter Rosin
On 2014-05-13 14:29, Steven Penny wrote:

> On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 12:56 AM, Christopher Faylor wrote:
>> Frankly, please give MSYS2 another try.  We'd all appreciate it.
>
> Look at the facts:
>
> coreutils
> newer version released 2 years ago
>
> bash
> newer version released 3 years ago
>
> git
> newer version released 2 years ago
>
> These are major packages, not just "user X favorite package". Several people
> including myself have offered to update them, only to be met with "Sorry, I am
> maintainer not you. I will do it when I get time". It gets old after a while.

Now, I'm just a random user, but exactly because these are major packages, it's
good to have a maintainer that actually understands and fixes problems related
to Cygwin, instead of having a maintainer that just builds the latest version
and uploads it. Given that you seem to love MSYS2 so much, I can report that I
recently dealt with a \r-issue with MSYS2 bash. I'd rather have a maintainer
that insulates me from \r-issues and says "no" before they hit me, than have a
maintainer that don't understand why stripping every \r in sight isn't such a
good idea. (to be fair, I'm not 100% sure it was an issue with the official
MSYS2 bash or if it was some 3rd party patch on top of the official MSYS2 bash,
I don't run MSYS2 personally).

That said, I'd also love a bash update, but I'd rather have a working bash than
a new bash. Because it is a major package.

2 cents

Cheers,
Peter


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Re: Update CoreUtils

Christopher Faylor-8
In reply to this post by Steven Penny
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 07:29:10AM -0500, Steven Penny wrote:
>These are major packages, not just "user X favorite package". Several people
>including myself have offered to update them, only to be met with "Sorry, I am
>maintainer not you. I will do it when I get time". It gets old after a while.

Frankly, so does your posting style.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Chris J. Breisch-2
In reply to this post by Steven Penny
Steven Penny wrote:
> These are major packages, not just "user X favorite package". Several people
> including myself have offered to update them, only to be met with "Sorry, I am
> maintainer not you. I will do it when I get time". It gets old after a while.
>

Well, if you don't want to wait, and you're confident of your ability to
update, then do so. You don't have to publish the package to use it on
your own system.

I don't know anything about the git source, but I know that bash and
coreutils are a pain to update, because there's so much in both that
depends upon Windows text mode/binary mode annoyances. Also, bash (I
believe) understands Windows paths, and that doesn't make porting any
easier either. I spent a very brief time looking at updating bash
myself, and decided it wasn't worth the pain.

I've done a little with coreutils in the past, and I suspect if I had
to, I could update it using the patches from the last version as a
starting point, but I haven't found a need to do so yet.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Steven Penny
In reply to this post by Peter Rosin
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 7:46 AM, Peter Rosin wrote:
> I'd rather have a maintainer
> that insulates me from \r-issues and says "no" before they hit me, than have a
> maintainer that don't understand why stripping every \r in sight isn't such a
> good idea.

We already have a system in place for this. The Cygwin installer allows you to
choose "Curr" or "Exp". "Curr" being stable version and "Exp" being
experimental. Except the reality is that the choices are "old" and "old".

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Christopher Faylor-8
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 09:59:03AM -0500, Steven Penny wrote:
>On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 7:46 AM, Peter Rosin wrote:
>>I'd rather have a maintainer that insulates me from \r-issues and says
>>"no" before they hit me, than have a maintainer that don't understand
>>why stripping every \r in sight isn't such a good idea.
>
>We already have a system in place for this.  The Cygwin installer
>allows you to choose "Curr" or "Exp".  "Curr" being stable version and
>"Exp" being experimental.  Except the reality is that the choices are
>"old" and "old".

Funny how you're saying "We" as if you are actually contributing
anything other than criticism.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Steven Penny
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 10:04 AM, Christopher Faylor wrote:
> Funny how you're saying "We" as if you are actually contributing
> anything other than criticism.

You want me to contribute? Give me maintenance over one of the aforementioned
packages. Ball is in your court.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Chris J. Breisch-2
Steven Penny wrote:
> On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 10:04 AM, Christopher Faylor wrote:
>> Funny how you're saying "We" as if you are actually contributing
>> anything other than criticism.
>
> You want me to contribute? Give me maintenance over one of the aforementioned
> packages. Ball is in your court.
>
If you're ready to maintain something, then you must have successfully
built the version of the package you want to maintain, applied any
necessary Cygwin patches, and gotten it to successfully work on your
machine.

Since you've done all that, I am touched by your concern that the rest
of us are running out-of-date stuff, and am glad that you are so eager
to contribute. I'm sure Eric et al. would be happy to accept the
assistance. PTC. (http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#PTC)

Of course, if you haven't yet successfully built the version of the
package you want to maintain, haven't applied the necessary Cygwin
patches, and haven't gotten it to successfully work on your machine,
then it's a bit ludicrous to expect someone to name you the maintainer
of said package. You haven't shown any evidence of your ability to
perform in that capacity.



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Re: Update CoreUtils

Larry Hall (Cygwin)
On 05/13/2014 02:36 PM, Chris J. Breisch wrote:

> Steven Penny wrote:
>> On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 10:04 AM, Christopher Faylor wrote:
>>> Funny how you're saying "We" as if you are actually contributing
>>> anything other than criticism.
>>
>> You want me to contribute? Give me maintenance over one of the aforementioned
>> packages. Ball is in your court.
>>
> If you're ready to maintain something, then you must have successfully built
> the version of the package you want to maintain, applied any necessary
> Cygwin patches, and gotten it to successfully work on your machine.
>
> Since you've done all that, I am touched by your concern that the rest of us
> are running out-of-date stuff, and am glad that you are so eager to
> contribute. I'm sure Eric et al. would be happy to accept the assistance.
> PTC. (http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#PTC)
>
> Of course, if you haven't yet successfully built the version of the package
> you want to maintain, haven't applied the necessary Cygwin patches, and
> haven't gotten it to successfully work on your machine, then it's a bit
> ludicrous to expect someone to name you the maintainer of said package. You
> haven't shown any evidence of your ability to perform in that capacity.

...and Eric has.  Until he relinquishes his packages or disappears, the
majority (at least) of those on the list that use his packages appreciate
his efforts in the past and look forward to his support going forward.

If Eric decides to give up one or more of the packages you're interested
in picking up as maintainer, then we'll all be appreciative of your efforts
too. :-)


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_____________________________________________________________________

A: Yes.
 > Q: Are you sure?
 >> A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation.
 >>> Q: Why is top posting annoying in email?

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Eric Blake (cygwin)-2
On 05/13/2014 12:47 PM, Larry Hall (Cygwin) wrote:

>> Of course, if you haven't yet successfully built the version of the
>> package
>> you want to maintain, haven't applied the necessary Cygwin patches, and
>> haven't gotten it to successfully work on your machine, then it's a bit
>> ludicrous to expect someone to name you the maintainer of said
>> package. You
>> haven't shown any evidence of your ability to perform in that capacity.
>
> ...and Eric has.  Until he relinquishes his packages or disappears, the
> majority (at least) of those on the list that use his packages appreciate
> his efforts in the past and look forward to his support going forward.
>
> If Eric decides to give up one or more of the packages you're interested
> in picking up as maintainer, then we'll all be appreciative of your efforts
> too. :-)
For that matter, I've _already_ offered git up for another maintainer,
and am still waiting (at least 3 months later) for that transition to
completely materialize.  With progress like that, I'm less than
enthusiastic about handing over coreutils or bash.  But if you want to
post a test package for bash and/or coreutils, I'll at least review your
packaging to see if it looks like you preserved all the cygwin-specific
patches I already created, before deciding that handing over
maintainership makes sense.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Christian Franke
In reply to this post by Eric Blake (cygwin)-2
Eric Blake wrote:
> On 05/11/2014 10:42 AM, Steven Penny wrote:
>> Can we get an update? I can create a build if needed.
> I haven't relinquished maintainership of this package yet.  It's still
> on my list of things to build, when I get a moment (although free time
> has been a bit sparse as of late with the birth of my daughter last month).
>

Please note that a new x86 coreutils package should not install
'hostname' and will require a synchronized upload of the x86 hostname
package. The x86_64 distro already contains a hostname-less coreutils
and hostname package.

https://sourceware.org/ml/cygwin-apps/2013-04/msg00103.html
https://sourceware.org/ml/cygwin-apps/2013-08/msg00107.html

The download URL from above mail is no longer valid (dyn.com stopped the
free accounts).
New:

wget -e robots=off -np -nH --cut-dirs=1 -R'index.html*' -r \
http://chrfranke.no-ip.org/cygwin/x86/release/hostname

Christian


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Re: Update CoreUtils

Christopher Faylor-8
In reply to this post by Steven Penny
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 01:00:24PM -0500, Steven Penny wrote:
>On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 10:04 AM, Christopher Faylor wrote:
>>Funny how you're saying "We" as if you are actually contributing
>>anything other than criticism.
>
>You want me to contribute?  Give me maintenance over one of the
>aforementioned packages.  Ball is in your court.

You want to contribute?  Stop wasting my time with attitude and learn
the rules.  "Ball is in your court" but I'm not holding my breath for
you to do anything other than kvetch.

cgf

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Steven Penny
In reply to this post by Chris J. Breisch-2
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 1:36 PM, Chris J. Breisch wrote:
> Of course, if you haven't yet successfully built the version of the package
> you want to maintain, haven't applied the necessary Cygwin patches, and
> haven't gotten it to successfully work on your machine, then it's a bit
> ludicrous to expect someone to name you the maintainer of said package. You
> haven't shown any evidence of your ability to perform in that capacity.

# Bash
Yes, I have built up to date Bash, this would be my pick if I am allowed
maintainer as I feel it is an important package that should be up to date.

# Git
I have built up to date Git as well, but between Adam Dinwoodie build and
CygwinPorts build Git is "good enough" for now

# CoreUtils
I think I tried and failed to built this a year ago, lately I wanted an up to
date version of "dd" for the "skip_bytes" option, but I dont really need that
now, so it is lower priority
http://unix.stackexchange.com/a/121798

# apt-cyg
I just to add for Christopher Faylor and others that I maintain "apt-cyg" a
Cygwin package manager.
http://github.com/transcode-open/apt-cyg
Granted it is not an official package such as Bash, but it is something.

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Re: Update CoreUtils

Christopher Faylor-8
In reply to this post by Christopher Faylor-8
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 03:29:40PM -0400, Christopher Faylor wrote:

>On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 01:00:24PM -0500, Steven Penny wrote:
>>On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 10:04 AM, Christopher Faylor wrote:
>>>Funny how you're saying "We" as if you are actually contributing
>>>anything other than criticism.
>>
>>You want me to contribute?  Give me maintenance over one of the
>>aforementioned packages.  Ball is in your court.
>
>You want to contribute?  Stop wasting my time with attitude and learn
>the rules.  "Ball is in your court" but I'm not holding my breath for
>you to do anything other than kvetch.

I've taken the ball back.  We don't need a new maintainer.

I've spoken with Eric.  I'm relieved that he still wants to stay on.

If his, or any other maintainer's update speed is not meeting
expectations then please, as suggested, just build the packages for your
own use.

cgf

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